Open Practice vs Sessions

hershey said:
Im old, slow and out of shape lol..... Generally when in my normal riding mode when I come to BC I will put 2 hrs on my hour meter at your track. You know me, you know my riding capabilities. When Im in shape and the right mindset any less than that I feel like I wasted my time. So for me sessions just plain suck. My normal routine at an NONsession track goes like this....

1. 10 min warm up ride with 10 min rest after
2. 20-30 min moto at avg heart rate 165 with 20 min rest after
3. 30-35 min moto at avg heart rate 165 with 20 min to half hour rest after
4. 20-30 min " " " " " " with 20 min to half hour rest after
5. sometimes I head home now or do one more 20 min moto.

This isnt everytime I practice but it is the average routine for me in the late spring through fall
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You are iron! I would be dead after a day like that at the Cliff. You would work great in a Cialis commercial, kinda like the other old dudes doin cool things to show they still got it.
 
hershey said:
Im old, slow and out of shape lol..... Generally when in my normal riding mode when I come to BC I will put 2 hrs on my hour meter at your track. You know me, you know my riding capabilities. When Im in shape and the right mindset any less than that I feel like I wasted my time. So for me sessions just plain suck. My normal routine at an NONsession track goes like this....

1. 10 min warm up ride with 10 min rest after
2. 20-30 min moto at avg heart rate 165 with 20 min rest after
3. 30-35 min moto at avg heart rate 165 with 20 min to half hour rest after
4. 20-30 min " " " " " " with 20 min to half hour rest after
5. sometimes I head home now or do one more 20 min moto.

This isnt everytime I practice but it is the average routine for me in the late spring through fall
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BS. You need to ride harder...this isn't a marathon sport. So you do go out about 4 times though??
 
Awww. IMO-- sessions suck! If you were going to do sessions, I'd do a faster group, and a slower group-- that's it. another option would be to have one group have the track from say... 10-1, and have the other group go from 1-4. After 4, it's an open track.

Another route, (I've done a bit of road racing) would be to steal from the pavement track day system. They have a flag displayed at the start/finish at all times. A green flag means: "open track/no restrictions", a yellow flag means: "The track is getting crowded, and/or there are beginners on the track. Exercise caution, and passing is allowed on the outside only". A black flag means that it is "Expert/fast novice practice only", a blue flag means that it's practice for the beginners/slow novices, and a red flag means that the track is closed due to something slippery on the track, injury, or track maintainance. At many tracks, the beginners wear an orange vest over their leathers. This indicates that the rider is new, so observe caution in their presence.

These are some possibilities, but I prefer my dad's way of prevention. Before I did anything that could be potentially dangerous, my dad used to tell me-- "Don't let anything stupid happen!". I guess that sums it up! --L*64
 
BriarcliffMx said:
BS. You need to ride harder...this isn't a marathon sport. So you do go out about 4 times though??
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Yeah 4-5 times. But realistically I put 1 1/2 to 2 hrs on the hour meter. No offence intended here but the one time I did a local well liked track with sessions last year I was there all day and got about 45 mins on the hour meter. Wasnt happy and havent been back.
 
That's the best solution for OH motocross I've heard yet. Ban open practice! Yippie
ck1racerx said:
15 min sessions from 10am to 5 pm. That is 28 sessions. Group one big bikes. Group 2 85 and fast 65. Session 3 50's and beginner 65. That gives everyone at least 8 sessions with is 2 hours of seat time. If you are not happy with 2 hours of seat time in one day... well maybe you are an iron man. In my BEST condition there is no way I could have done 2 hours at full tilt.

Point is. Sessions are the only way to go. It is safer, more organized, more competitive and more then anything, fair to everyone that is there to ride. Besides that. When its not your session, get your arse out on the track and direct riders away from downed guys that may not have been seen.
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Sounds like you have it all figured out and should still open a track! Safer AND more competitive-- So groups of people riding harder/faster (basically racing now) than they might usually is somehow safer. And then you assume that people who are not riding will assume the job of flagger instead of sitting back at the truck.

How is an open practice session unfair? Have never left an open practice and felt that I was jipped. The opposite effect is felt after leaving split sessions practice. I understand a mini not might get as much track time but we were all young once.. again don't recall leaving tracks upset because I didn't get to ride enough. Even now I'll stay at the truck when the track is basically a train of a/b guys flying.

Some people (like myself) go to practice for the freedom and ability to get as much (or as little) track time as I feel necessary. I really like how BC runs their program, mid day prep, big bikes and then a mini session. No need to split up the whole day when the majority of "big bikes" can co-exist fine.
 
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I agree with what Hershey and Bill480 just said. When I go to a track with sessions 50 min.to 1 hour on meter not enough seat time for me. I usually
do 6 sessions at Cliff on open practice day's and put 1 1/2 to 1:45 on the meter. Would I still go to the Cliff with sessions, yes but prob.not as much if
another track was open that doesn't run sessions. And no offense Knox but you see a little bit of a different crowd at New Vienna than you do at the Cliff.
 
Yes, you get a different crowd but you still have basically the same mix. Beginners, guys just having fun, "B" racers, A riders, 85's, 65's and 50's. The kids on the 50, 65 and 85's paid the same $25 bucks you did and they are left to ride on a tiny track, OR risk their lives and ride with the big bikes... Oh wait, you guys already said they should not be out there with the big bikes. Who cares about them though, They are young now...right?
Yeap, that's fair
 
Hey everyone first off prayers to all involved in this horrific situation. I am trying to understand this correctly and may be off on the facts but wasn't it two younger riders involved in this accident? And I guess my question is who is going to decide what session riders should be in I have personally seen some real goons that think they are B class riders but in reality they are at best slow C riders. And unfortunately do to the nature of the sport this situation is likely to happen again then what? I follow the concerns of smaller riders mixed with bigger bikes but a slow 450 rider is just as dangerous if not more so then a fast 65 rider. I guess the only thing I can say is we have to watch out for each other and remember its practice and all levels of riders are out there. This is just my opinion and we all no what they say about opinions
 
psycobikerbob said:
Hey everyone first off prayers to all involved in this horrific situation. I am trying to understand this correctly and may be off on the facts but wasn't it two younger riders involved in this accident? And I guess my question is who is going to decide what session riders should be in I have personally seen some real goons that think they are B class riders but in reality they are at best slow C riders. And unfortunately do to the nature of the sport this situation is likely to happen again then what? I follow the concerns of smaller riders mixed with bigger bikes but a slow 450 rider is just as dangerous if not more so then a fast 65 rider. I guess the only thing I can say is we have to watch out for each other and remember its practice and all levels of riders are out there. This is just my opinion and we all no what they say about opinions
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I'm not going out with this guy, psycobikerbob! Sounds scary, lol. Welcome.
 
Sessions mean less than an hour on the bike and open = 1.5 to 2. Sessions always turn into less than 15min and only 4 times out on the track!
 
Point is. Sessions are the only way to go. It is safer, more organized, more competitive and more then anything, fair to everyone that is there to ride.

PRP always ran Open practice for an hour or so then broke up Big/Little. If crowded then went to AB/CD/Minis.
 
I hate sessions. But i'll ride them.

But people also have to remember that it's freaking practice. You can ride hard! But if you come up on a slower rider, you don't have to PASS right this second. You got the whole track to pass...and if you notice someone down, you can, actually, SLOW down. I can't tell you how many times i'll stop after noticing someone hit the ground and direct other riders away from the incident.

When people do not use their brains, we get to have sessions, so people can think for us. So then we have to ride in a safe environment because we are to stupid to realize it's practice.

Point being: IT'S PRACTICE, YOU HAVE AN UNLIMITED AMOUNT OF LAPS TO MASTER THAT SECTION, BRO. Slow it down.
 
Also not a fan of sessions. Yes, I understand if there are hundreds of riders varying from 6 years old to 60 years old, then it is necessary. But, I feel like my time and money is wasted when there are three 85's and 30 big bikes, and practice gets split up into Minis, A/B, C, (Vet).

I also never understood why people continue to ride past a downed rider, let alone at race speed. Every time I see a downed rider I do my best to caution people or get to the downed rider as quickly as possible if nobody is there. It is a common courtesy, that I'd want done for me. So, why not do the same for someone else.

Overall, I think the stem of all these issues is the lack of common sense by a few individuals. Which in turn, spoils it for everyone else.
 
I fall in the category of not wanting to spend all day at the track for practice, aka "new generation".
For me open practice is the way to go with my work schedule. I try to squeeze in a warm up session, then 4 25 minute practice motos on my own schedule.
Not that I don't think the mini guys deserve to ride the big track and get their time, but if it means waiting an hour inbetween my rides for a few 15 minute sessions, then I'm gonna have to look elsewhere to ride. This isn't everyone's case, but absolutely is mine.
Seems like most tracks run open practice during the week and some do sessions on the weekend which gives plenty of riding options for everyone
 
DelBalso, so the 85s are supposed to just get scheduled around you and the big bikes? Here is the issue. 65s and 85s need practice on the big tracks, because at the end of the day, they race on the exact same track as you do. So why should 65s or 85s be forced to the C track at BC? There is nothing on that track too difficult for minis to ride. They also pay $25 to practice just like the big bikes.

It boils down to people not having courtesy for anyone else, because they live in their little bubbles where everyone gets what they want. In my opinion if a track is having prepped practice, and charging to practice, they should have sessions. If you want to go ride on a private track or some where where they are not charging to ride, do whatever you want. Track owners have to get insurance for those practice days, I would think they would want sessions to cover their own butts.

Buckeye Hills MX recently opened up again as a practice track. It used to be Highland Lakes and held races. Reason they closed up for a few years? Someone landed on someone and killed them. That case I believe was a big bike landing on a big bike, but it still happened. In my opinion it is only smart to use common sense! If you have a super mini that is super fast.......let him out with the big bikes. It is not difficult for someone running a track to judge someone's talent on the race track.
 
John250 said:
DelBalso, so the 85s are supposed to just get scheduled around you and the big bikes? Here is the issue. 65s and 85s need practice on the big tracks, because at the end of the day, they race on the exact same track as you do. So why should 65s or 85s be forced to the C track at BC? There is nothing on that track too difficult for minis to ride. They also pay $25 to practice just like the big bikes.
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To quote myself "Not that I don't think the mini guys deserve to ride the big track and get their time, but if it means waiting an hour inbetween my rides for a few 15 minute sessions, then I'm gonna have to look elsewhere to ride."

Here's where I get to say "not my problem". I have no problem riding an open practice with minis that are jumping the majority of the jumps. Heck I loved practicing with big bikes when I was on minis. If the parents are not comfortable with jr being out there for open practice, not my problem.
Some tracks used to have mini practice days(maybe they still do). Of course that won't work if dad wants to ride too. Again, not my problem.
If I have to look elsewhere to ride my open practice, isn't it only fair that minis (and dads) have to look elsewhere for their sessioned practices?
If track owners decide to switch to sessions, more power to them I'll just have to look elsewhere. I'm not saying tracks can't do that because I need my open practice. Any reason you have to support sessioned practice is simply not my problem.
 
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